Making Presidential HistoryDavid Greenberg discusses what George W. Bush's legacy will be.

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Okay, he hasn't done any of these things ... the media has said he has and people are stupid enough to believe it. We aren't torturing anyone (Bill Clinton started the policy of rendition), name one restriction on your liberty? Did you just close your eyes and cut and paste from moveon.org.

David Greenberg: This is the kind of vitriol that gives chats like this, and blogs and the like, a bad name.

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Stafford, Va.: How much will Bush get the blame for things that his administration had done and how much blame will Cheney get, if any at all?

David Greenberg: The buck stops here, as Bush's (sort of) hero Harrry Truman said. Cheney, I surmise from what I read, is very influential. But Bush is the "decider," and he is free to reject his vice president's advice whenever he chooses. I am always amazed at the degree to which Cheney gets blamed or described as more powerful than Bush. Yes, he has great influence on Bush--but only because Bush values his input. Colin Powell, in the first term, began as a man with considerable stature. But by and large Bush didn't follow his advice, and so he turned out not to have the power that many had predicted.

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Middletown, R.I.: I am 64-years-old. I was talking to a WWII vet recently and both of us came to the conclusion that George W. Bush is the worst president in our lifetimes. Both of us are mostly upset by the Iraq War Policy and its human and economic cost. I feel that he and Cheney deserve to be impeached but am not sure what that would accomplish except to show for the record how he abused his official powers and betrayed the values that our government was founded on. Bush and the neocons should reflect on the results of their policies and stop trying to justify them. They were wrong and should take responsibility for them! Do you think that the future conservative faction of the Republican party will ever admit this?

David Greenberg: Two point here. First, I hope it's clear by now that while I certainly judge the war and other actions of this administration harshly, it's simply premature to declare Bush the worst president ever, or the worst of our times. Back in December, I and several other historians were asked by the Washington Post's Outlook section to answer whether Bush is "the worst." I began my piece by noting how many other presidents, including Truman and Eisenhower, were called "the worst" in their own days. That kind of rhetoric is natural, but it doesn't mean much.

Second, I think that a lot of Republicans and conservatives are indeed admitting they were wrong about the war. If anything, there's sometimes an effort to make Bush shoulder all the blame. We forget how much support he has had from Congress, the courts, much of the media, and indeed much of the public, for many things he did that are now unpopular. Yes, as president, he bears chief responsibility. But he didn't cause all our problems singlehandedly.

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Bridgewater, Mass.: Letting history judge means letting historians look at the evidence, which Bush has never seemed interested in: one of his first actions as president was to protect presidential documents from inspection for the foreseeable future, wasn't it? Perhaps what he has in mind is more spinning the historical interpretation of his time in office than an objective examination?

David Greenberg: That's a very important point. Bush did expand the president's ability to close off presidential records, and to classify records, and that was reprehensible. In the long run (we hope) they will still become public, but what he's doing is affording himself protection for more than the 12 years that under Clinton had been (I believe; I haven't double checked this) the norm for disclosure of presidential records.

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Los Angeles, Calif.: Is it Bush's or the neocons' legacy? The worst disasters of his presidency seem to have been the result of his advisors (and his inability to stand up to them). Bush's personal projects, such as lower taxes for the rich, disastrous No Child Left Behind, etc. will not have the lasting impact of the inroads on the Constitution and the Iraq War.

David Greenberg: I think we should avoid the term "neocon" here. Bush is not a neocon, nor is Cheney, nor Rumsfeld. They are conservatives. Neoconservatism was the name given in the early 1970s to thinkers like Irving Kristol and Norman Podhoretz who grew disillusioned in the 1960s with liberalism and moved to the right. And while some Bush aides, such as Paul Wolfowitz, may have been influenced by neoconservative thought, the chief policymakers—Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice—do not fit the neocon profile. Unfortunately, the term neocon has crept into the language to describe Bush. I think it should be avoided.

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New York: First, let's not forget Shopenhauer's view of Hegelian philosophy: "... a pseudo-philosophy paralyzing all mental powers, stifling all real thinking, and, by the most outrageous misuse of language, putting in its place the hollowest, most senseless, thoughtless, and, as is confirmed by its success, most stupefying verbiage. ..." Yep! Sounds like the Bushies to me!

David Greenberg: I'm not familiar with that quote from Schopenhauer (sp?), but the more recondite continental philosophy we can bring to bear on this discussion the better!

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New York: Hi, David. Thanks for the chat. Wondered why in your Slate article you didn't touch on other historical world leaders and their affinity w/ Hegel's special brand of philosophy. I'm talking primarily about Adolf Hitler, of course.

If one needs an example of a philosophy which can lead millions of people into ruin, then one need look no further than the philosophy of Hegel; it has been "the justification of extremist authoritarian creeds from Fascism to Communism." (Chambers)

David Greenberg: Well, the article was meant to be about Bush, not about Hegel. I'm reminded of a quote from Ted Sorensen, JFK's old speechwriter, who said at a memorial service for the late Arthur Schlesinger (and I'm paraphrasing here) that when the two men were co-writing an op-ed piece about the Iraq War, Schlesinger suggested they add a quote from Hegel. When Sorensen then tried to throw in some German philosophy, Schlesinger clarified: "No, I meant Chuck Hagel!"

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Washington, D.C.: History will be kind to w. ...

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